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Expert
Posts: 2118
 
Location: The Heart of Space | Hi all:
"To be effective on a large scale, love needs the help of social structures and a collective ethos; without these, it preaches ends without means."
Do you all agree? Disagree?
Peas and L'Amor,
Marty, Lucky, Poppy
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Member
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| Love is where we are all heading towards or away from.
I would say, love doesn't really need help, but people may need help in order to reach love. Which means... I suppose I disagree. Maybe I misunderstood the question. |
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Expert
Posts: 2118
Location: The Heart of Space | Hi Eye:
I think the quote attempts to define love in an active sense....example.....if you were lying on the ground, I would attempt to pick you up; but what would happen to you if I didn't come along.....what would happen to you if many passed you by; or an authority figure spied you and reacted in one of many different ways, perhaps even beating you for obstructing the sidewalk.
I read and see and hear many people talk of love....but you say we head towards or away.....from what???? What is the "love" that we all speak of and what is it's reach and extent?
Personally, I can put it in a very visual way....the movie...I believe it is the Seventh Seal ( the one with Demi Moore). The demonic centurion asks "would you die for him?"
meaning would this chick give it up for Christ and all the future unborn. So, naturally she says yes.....or else you gotta bad movie ending.
Can we, in any form of human compact, "give it up" for the love of the common good...forget about religious zeal, forget about Allah and Christ, can we live in a world of love??
Ya Mon,
Marty, Lucky, Poppy
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PhD Alumni
Posts: 4414
Location: United Kingdom | Seventh Seal - Demi Moore - ? Is that a reprise of Bergman's - one of the- greatest films of all time, The Seventh Seal?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anvRFJFUnRE
I think the Beatles had a great line about love:
'And in the end the love you take is equal to the love you make'
Isn't love beyond institutions>? |
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Ph.D. Alumni
Posts: 694
 
Location: New Smyrna Beach, Florida | Marty,
Much has been said of Love and the Soul. I believe that some like or may dislike quotes but here are a couple anyway.
" You must enshrine in your hearts the spiritual urge towards light and love, Wisdom and Bliss!"
Sri Sathya Sai Baba
" The real problem is in the hearts and minds of men. It is easier to denature plutonium than to denature the evil spirit of man."
Albert Einstein
" This is the ultimate end of man, to find the One which is in him; which is his truth, which is his soul; the key with which he opens the gate of the spiritual life, the heavenly kingdom."
Rabindranath Tagore
And finally my favorite:
" May those who love us, love us; and those who don't love us, may God turn their hearts; and if He doesn't turn their hearts, may he turn their ankles so we'll know them by their limping."
Irish Blessings
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btw I agree with you, we need a new paradigm shift towards a Heart Centered consciousness. I believe its on its way, just hope we are able to get it before we destroy ourselves.
mi cincuenta centavos worth
Leo
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PhD Alumni
Posts: 4414
Location: United Kingdom | Maybe Marty might have meant the Seventh Sign ?
Reading Marty's post again made me think of the Righteous Just, such as Maximillian Kolb and Raoul Wallenberg
Edited by Paul Joseph 10/13/2011 4:15 PM
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Ph.D. Alumni
Posts: 694
Location: New Smyrna Beach, Florida | I'm not sure about "Seventh Sign" or "Seventh Seal" I believe his message/question to us is from his last sentence;
"Can we, in any form of human compact, "give it up" for the love of the common good...forget about religious zeal, forget about Allah and Christ, can we live in a world of love??"
Pretty much sums it all up. Hence my response in my previous post.
I believe we can with a big "however", its going to take time and my question is do we have enough time? Will the Heart Centered paradigm shift be enough and will it be in time?
I hope we here are all giving this a great deal of "Intent"
Blessings
Leo |
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Expert
Posts: 2118
Location: The Heart of Space | Thank'ee kindly Sir Paul......
Seventh Sign!
I haven't seen a Bergman flick since the Fine Arts Club university days.
My Demi (on tape) hasn't been played since the early 90's and exhibits a bad "tracking" problem. Soooo....to the bin it goes...maybe it is online somewhere....free?
Peace and Marmite (you either "love" it or you hate it)!
Pyschomarty and Luckylee, Poppyhead
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UMS Student
Location: Bellingham | your original statement ignores the question 'are we to know the difference between ends and means?' to your last statement(and in the internet's present state), "ain't nothin' free" guy fox day come and gone. cause |
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| cause - 10/16/2011 4:37 AM ... guy fox day come and gone. cause I do not personally accept any days of the week being special for me above any other or others, and I am nothing special or especial and mess things up in multiple languages at the same time.... So I am not supposed to by my belief system allow this withouts a dennouncement ofs it hitherto.... LOL Thanks |
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PhD Alumni
Posts: 4414
Location: United Kingdom | Ha - thanks too Marty - did you check out the You Tube link to Seventh Seal ? Might be useful too for Leo's second dissertation; it's a meditation on how we respond to and deal with, the inevitability of our own, each of ours, unique demise ... demise, demis, demi de-moore ... oops, found myself in a bit of word play there, sorry about that ... Inna does quite good trance type dance music too, bit different to Sir Paul M ... wouldn;t have been able to have gone to their 'do', Sunday lunch times are taking out aged mother-in-law times, though have seen him knocking about in the restaurant we frequent ....
Love is incredibly paradoxical is it not, 'love' in its passionate, human form can drive us literally out of our minds, I think, and have some experience of .... maybe that's why God incarnated and incarnates him/herself in us, each of us, for that chance to lose, let go, and be found again. Dunno |
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Hi Paul, Hey, I am in the middle of taking the UMS Trauma and Recovery course, and it states to be full human is to be insane "Since this inhumanity has become a compulsory feature of life in modern industrial society, any member of this society who insists on being fully human must be classed by psychiatry as insane" From page 1 Trauma & Recovery Healing Through Traumatic Experience Written by Balthazar Seferiades Just thought I would throw in some supporting information (or a twist) to the human case for what we consider as love or insanity, as Marty is right, we do not really know what love is, we seem to call some actions love, but are capable of this as a species, as we are now? If I stirred the pot too much here I am sorry!!! Love and Light |
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UMS Guest
Posts: 1938
Location: United Kingdom | 'While proclaiming love and peace with your lips, take care you also feel them in your heart.' Francis of Assisi More important still, act upon them! With love - Aquarius 
Edited by Aquarius 1/30/2016 7:24 AM
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UMS Student
Location: Bellingham | fox fires, I can appreciate your response to days that people find import in while you do not. I don't make a practice of watching the news for simallar reasons. I erred in my thought of guy fox day. It is acualy the 15th of october.
Edited by cause 10/20/2011 3:53 PM
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Cause, Don't worry about it, I am not anything special! So have a good one, and take it easy Love and Light |
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PhD Alumni
Posts: 4414
Location: United Kingdom | Interesting Aqua cites St Francis. An old, dear friend of mine, now deceased, whom I have mentioned here before, Brother Ian Scott of the Society of St Francis (Anglican Fransciscans) used to relate to me his encounter with the Holy Spirit which was to lead him into living on the roads, before becoming a Franciscan, and how it was like being filled with a fire which drove him mad.... like FF says also, I agree, I think it is the madness of being fully human, where the heart is exposed and all embracing; as St Francis embraced the person with leprosy ... love drives us out of our mind - maybe into the heart if we are lucky, though not always ...
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Paul, I do agree, but sort of ask, not to get an answer, but just to ponder.... But is to be fully human to be god like and know unconditional love.... I feel this can provide a serious dark night of the soul.... But some people have dark weeks or months of the soul.... I feel there is an insanity of life and living that has to be acclimated to... And this could be the spirit filling us as it cleans us out from personal issues Love and Light |
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Expert
Posts: 2118
Location: The Heart of Space | Greetings and Salutations and Fine Mornings to you Causey......
Ya got me curious.....who is the "Guy Fox" you twice or thrice referred to? What did he do? I don't think I know the chap. Apparently he has his day.....as also every dog does.
Now Cause........see what you did? You made me think of old movies....there was a serial movie that Disney aired way way way back when Disney was exclusively on NBC, one of the three channels on teeee-veeee, called "Zorro" starring Guy Williams.
"Zorro, he makes the sign of the Z,
Zorro, a gay caballero is he"
You may ask, why did this make me think of Zorro??????????????? En espanol, zorro significa FOX!!!!!!!!!!!!
Paz a Todo El Mundo,
Martine, y mis gatas
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Hi There Marty! Hey this was over the Sabbath discussion and Saturday vs Sunday.... IT was sort of a joke that Saturday was my holly day or something to that effect.... I just expressed a disclaimer that I was no one special Love and Light |
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PhD Alumni
Posts: 4414
Location: United Kingdom | Yes, FF, I think I am very aware of that darkness ... takes some working through, or maybe, just to Be there; one of those places that we called upon to Be sometimes, but that doesn't make it any easier ... |
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Paul, Being in this state is not fun, the single point that might help is the concept of Dancing The Dream (1999), “Our personal viewpoints tend to anchor us in one level of experience, keeping us attached to ideas and feelings that disallow expansion. There are millions of valid truths in our world. We will eventually gain the skill needed to recognize and assimilate the validity in all human viewpoints while maintaining our uniqueness as well as detached neutrality.” Recovery entails being fully present in the moment, and full presence can only be achieved in the absence of thoughts that limit our perceptions. Such limiting thoughts can be discovered and eliminated through meditation, as we will see later. But first, we must explore the nature of the preconceptions that already limit and distort our collective perception of the process of recovery " "In accord with this philosophy, a mind free of assumptions and preconceptions will be better able to create an accurate picture of reality. This means that we must let go of our own opinions and beliefs to a certain extent, and cultivate an attitude of neutrality, if we wish to be free of misconceptions and illusions. Jamie Sams further states in From: Trauma & Recovery ©2005 University Of Metaphysical Sciences Page 12 What helped me the most was to just ride through the event, and not draw emotions and label them, sort of like riding through a storm in a small boat or being inside a pressure cooker... The more I surrendered, the more I got blasted with, till I had to surrender to, I want to find something that is funny or amusing.... As there is no right and wrong and we seem to need to help or leave people alone who do not want to change. Just my rantings and musings Thanks!!!! |
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UMS Student
Location: Bellingham | FoxFires, happiness is a metaphysics I aspire to as well. I love the quote. I found that the statements placed in the future we already have, Dizzing! It is media I would like to view, alone. I find watching something alone sometimes improves my ability to aproach a subject critically. I would like to have found the statement in a different context. I don't understand the emnity. I really don't. I am sending a piece of British/Canadian humor at its least excusable. We will save reverence for later, if we cannot find it now. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzHhC2-DL-A
Edited by cause 10/24/2011 7:14 PM
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UMS Student
Location: Bellingham | It is a wonder that we are so acustom to debate in open forums while the student page is so harmonious. |
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Hi Cause, I do not always get to pick the when and where of what is shared by others, my goal is to show that there might not be that much difference between spiritual and religious beliefs.... But everything others do might be right or correct, but it is all in perception, and the humans who listen are by my intentions to find a single thing that can help with an understanding.... So I do ride the fence, and try to never say another is wrong, but to like a Polaroid Instant camera, take a snap shot of the events and say look for the the differences,,,, and note what is similar, and see what can help us with our growth Love and Light |
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Alumni
Posts: 862
| Hey Cause, I watched the video and it is about emotional detachment, and not caring with some humor. This also seemed to be third person emotions in play where things were described in a way where there was no interest in anything anyone was doing Love and Light |
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Love
