DEATH ANYONE?
mruppert
Posted 7/24/2008 12:25 AM (#7640)
Subject: DEATH ANYONE?



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Hi all:
     Paul made a statement in another forum in response to ( I think ) my statement. I said that I am not afraid of death. He said that "everyone" is afraid of death.
     Please correct me if I got it wrong, PJ!
     I think PeeJays statement had some meaning for me when I was much younger, and in a situation where I really did not want something bad to happen, particulary to me.
      But, now, I stand by what I said. True, I have concerns about immediate things....if a plane dropped on my head, who would feed the cats? If I were in the plane that dropped, same concern! Who is gonna feed the cats....they like to eat twice a day!
      So, Paul, I turn it back to you...you tell me why everyone is afraid of death. And, let everyone here declare that to be so!
      I have not the least bit of fear of it.....because I know that it is gonna happen, sooner or later. I hope that it is much much much later, but as the clock ticks, I know it gets less and lesser.
      But, you look at Jilly, she is surrounded by it. Yet, it doesn't diminish her spirit in the least iota. Maybe Jillster can give us some insight, maybe Jillster can allay your fears.

Peace, n' Love and Eternal Life,
Marty and Survivor Cats, Lucky, Poppyhead and CiccyGirl
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Tracy Martin
Posted 7/24/2008 1:07 AM (#7643 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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The meditations which relieve me of the most heaviness, the most stress are the ones in which I surrender myself to a vast Ocean of darkness. I allow myself to drown in it! I come out of it with a whole lot more peace than when I went in. But, why do I bring my meditation to a symbolic death? Because that is the most impactful event to my sense of self, to survival, and is a balm for all the fears that surround threats to my life, both egoic and physical. I do it because I recognize a primal fear that is built in to the being I perceive myself to be, in order to transcend my fear, and the temporary, changing, challenging reality I find myself in. Why do I do it? Because I seek a meaning and a sense of completion that transcends life and can see me through life. I recognize a certain terror that occasionally clutches me, the fear of my own death. When I was younger this fear was buried deeper and I projected that fear outward believing that I just couldn't handle the grief and loneliness that is felt by those remaining. And then, I witnessed my brothers death.

Allowing that this was indeed my inner perception, and I have experienced this 'feeling' at other times in my life, here is what happened. When his breath stopped, I watched as the last pulsing vein ceased, and in that moment I was transported as if with him into a great Ocean. I watched as he seemed to dive gracefully into it. It was dark. It was brilliant. It was perfect harmony. It was everywhere. It was nothing, it contained everything. It knew everything. It was bliss.

We are learning to make peace with the great Unknown while we live in a world of paradoxes, of suffering and challenges, of light and shadow, of the Eternal Self and the small vulnerable human self. How to bring the realization of this great harmony into one's own heart? It takes focus, faith, love, and a recognition that the world is always moving towards us, teaching us, beckoning us to take a walk with it inwards and meet that same dark Ocean at the core of our being.

What is it about us that makes us fear Death? It is inescapable, it inevitably happens to every one of us. I believe in multiple realities and the eternity of Beingness.  When I die, I won't exactly be 'me' any more, but some 'not a thing' that is inextricably a part of a Awareness, beautiful, pregnant with life force, creativity, pure knowingness and peace.

I have had thousands more thoughts on this, because at many  points in my life I have thought a lot about Death.
But the bottom line is I don't know. Bless the Unknown.

Death anyone?
May I have some sugar with that please?
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mruppert
Posted 7/24/2008 2:02 AM (#7648 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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"Death anyone?
May I have some sugar with that please?" -T.Martin

Traceling....you are fan-damn-tastic!
And, I told you, a much better writer than I could eve hope to be.

With respect, dear lady,
Marty and Sleepyheads, Luckylee, Poppyhead & the Sisster
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/24/2008 4:00 AM (#7656 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Will come back to you on this, of course Marty, but I have at this moment a busy and fraught day ahead, so cannot just now; just to say thanks for the posts and will respond.

Board is full of life !!
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/24/2008 4:05 AM (#7657 - in reply to #7656)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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'I think, feel, that none of us humans can say, we do not fear death '

Marty - the above is what I said; slightly different naunce to 'everyone fears death', and it was written in resopnse, emoitonal response to specific issues on another thread, as much an emotional feeling than a philosophical construct... also comes from a depth psychological perspective.

Personally, I am not sure we really deep down KNOW what we feel until at the point of the Great White Light; but if you feel you are, so be it, I would not wish to lay siege to that. Now I must get on with my court documents ....
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sunflower
Posted 7/24/2008 6:47 AM (#7661 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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What is wrong with everyone today!!!!.My take on it,is,i think most of the population is afraid of death,maybe not the actual dying,and what comes after,if they beleive,but the manner in which way they will die,i,e.an incurable painful lingering disease,etc.We may have knowledge,and thoughts of the afterlife,home,some have had experiences of near death,and seen things,which i totaly beleive in,and to be true.But,(never start a sentence with but iris),having been in the company of quite a few terminal patients,and listening to their accounts,i.e.what they are seeing,or whom,they beleive in the afterlife,but when the time actualy comes,a little doubt comes through,we grieve for those we leave behind we wonder what will happen to us in our coffin,under the ground,etc,and we become afraid because we suddenly think,what if all i beleived in a lifetime,is not true,and so much more.I have had a very close relative die,i was there,holding her hand,she beleived totaly in the afterlife,but she at the last moments,feared what was to come,its natural,inborn in us as humanS,death is the greatest fear,its never talked about,because i feel,even though we know in our heart,it is our ultimate fate,the fear of how,when,in what way,etc,takes over,thats my opinion,and as i have always been spiritualy aware,etc.i would be lying if i said,even though i have a knowing,that the actual event,time,etc,does not still some fear in me,love and hugs irisxxx
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/24/2008 7:22 AM (#7662 - in reply to #7661)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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So well put Dear Iris, Sunfllower, Petal, thanks - that's what was in my mind ... might have got round to putting it down, but you have saved me the effort ... how well expressed ... I am just so buzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzily stressssssssssed today ... but trying to keep up ........................ xx
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Tracy Martin
Posted 7/24/2008 12:49 PM (#7671 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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I move in an out of feeling confident in my knowingness and doubtful of all that has ever been told. I still say, Bless the Unknown, cause its gonna happen some day no matter what I think and feel.

Sunflower, what a blessing to have been present for so many. If I were dying, I would want someone like you to hold me. Such love. Such kindness.
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/24/2008 3:34 PM (#7686 - in reply to #7671)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Ahh, me .. well then, since the unknown is inevitable we can either bless it or curse it ... or, as my dear old deceased friend Bro Ian SSF said, neither - embrace & accept it !

yet in blessing it we might also redeem it, and redeeming it, redeem ourselves xx

its late here for me and I am tired now = goodnight & sweet dreams all ...xxx
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Tracy Martin
Posted 7/24/2008 4:09 PM (#7688 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Here's what I wrote in the UMS Death and Dying Course:

Realizing how common the Fear of Death is,how strangling this fear can be, how gut-wrenching feelings of griefare, how we all dread even the news of the flood to come, helped me toknow that I can cope with my own feelings better. Re-experiencingmemories of those moments of fear and grief in the reading of thecourse, I experienced that fear as my future reality. I feeloverwhelming anguish when I think of losing my Mom. The fear and thegrief rise up even in the telling. The same for my sons. My own deathbrings out the Judge in me to accuse me and condemn me for all myfailures, and the victim child sobs as she embodies feelings of griefand fear in great shuddering abandon. I have a very dramatic innerlife.

But when my brother died, I experienced an ecstaticvision as I watched his pulse fade, so that the feelings of grief thatI had been having and expected to have also faded. What sadness I feltwas in missing Mark's presence, and sadness at the grief of our mother,his children, and family. Mark, or that essential energy that was warmand friendly, companionable, intelligent, and funny, is absolutelyfine. I feel certain that he is in a state of perfect harmony, peace,and fulfillment. Whether that means he is still Mark I do not know,or whether he reincarnates, I don't know. The personal identity seemsto matter less to me compared to the joy of diving into an Ocean ofBliss and feeling union with All.

I also felt proud of my familyand me throughout my brother's illness and dying. There was so muchlove and kindness and support all around, in spite of the anger,frustration, and fear. We were with him through it all. This pride gaveme a new inner acceptance and respect for the feelings I wasexperiencing, instead of my usual shame.

My feelings afterreading the course? I am still scared. Still grieving ahead of time. Imay continue on in my avoiding way and quell the fear of death thatway, or I may finally learn to have more compassion, trust, and peacethan fear and grief. Hopefully the latter. How I wish I could shinelike a more advanced and evolved person, one who has channeled spirits,and has utter confidence in past and future lives, and experienced theheavenly realms, or works in hospice care. I am more accepting of myignorance and my deep primal urges towards survival. I feel better.Powerful course! Peace!


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Supernatural3
Posted 7/24/2008 4:20 PM (#7690 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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It is NOT death we fear, it's the process of death and dying. We fear the pain, the suffering.

We also fear the unknown, which to some, it is unknown. So I can understand why some can truly think we all fear death, but I assure you. I do not FEAR death. I fear the process and hope that when it's my time, it's not traumatic, long or painful.

I certainly do not fear to be re-born into the spirit world by any means. I feel death is just Earth Graduation. As I channeled my mother-in-law just this past Christmas, who died Christmas Eve. I communicated with her fully. She was enjoying her graduation party. She said they were detaining her, due to it being theraputic to attend her own funeral. She was also accompanied by many. I mean TONS.... the party was HUGE. I could see so many people just in the other room.

Did I imagine all this? Who knows.... but she gave me names of people who were there with her (obviously crossed from earth), and my husband knew all the names I gave. These were not normal names either, they were unique (at least to me). I have only been married to my husband now for 3 years now and 3 days.  I couldn't have known these names, as I didn't prior.

She told me of a name, she heard her boys talking about at the morgue. I wasn't there. But I mentioned it to my husband and his mouth dropped. He knew I was not lying and knew that something did take place in communicating with his mom.

Am I crazy? Maybe...... But I will take my crazy over most people's sane.

Death? There is no death.... just a process of change.  

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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/25/2008 3:18 AM (#7692 - in reply to #7688)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Beautiful and open reflections, Tracy; many appreciations for laying your vulnerabilities open in this way ...

Who knows what we fear and don't fear and why ? I am often reminded here of God's answer to Job ....

I did my ums doctoral thesis on matters relating to death, dying and the aftermath; but I also resonate that, the more we know, the less we really know ... now Keats is coming to mind .. was it:

"Truth is beauty and beauty is truth; that's all ye know on earth and all ye need to know of Heaven" ? (from memory so could have the quote wrong ... aah, then, but what is truth (as Pilate asked Jesus, to which he, the Holy One, remained silent ... and what is beauty .... ?

So many questions, so little time !! xx
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/25/2008 10:41 AM (#7701 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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I disagree with knowing less, is knowing more.
When God gives you proof, isn't that a good knowing?

Each person has to experience their own truth, I have experienced mine. I have total faith in my experiences and it has brought me peice and knowing. To be honest, I wish everyone would have such experiences and one way or another, if they ask, they shall get. The problem is, they don't notice such experiences as being real. It takes confirmation, which is the convincer of that faith. Then their is no doubt, because that portion is removed once the experience takes place.

I have no doubt that God knows what he is doing. His knowledge is already inside of us all.


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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/25/2008 10:48 AM (#7702 - in reply to #7701)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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How synchronistic is that? I was ruminating about stuff, and looked at a quotation from Crowfoot, Native American ... and wondered if I should post it; then if I did, on what thread? Then thought, maybe this one, paradoxically: so went on it and here was a post from DocJ , so took that as a sign ...

WHAT IS LIFE ?

It is the flash of a firefly in the night.

It is the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime.

It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/25/2008 11:11 AM (#7705 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Yep, Quick indeed

If you think about it, compaired to all eternity, our life would be just a blink.

So the flash of a firefly in the night - would be letting your light shine, so others can find you.

It is the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime- would be for the warmth, given to others.

It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset - perhaps given a little shade to those who have taken on too much heat.

We all give so much...... even if we do not notice. Perhaps the shadows, heat and light are a great combination for life, as we experience it here.

Great Post Paul~
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/25/2008 11:15 AM (#7709 - in reply to #7705)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Thanks DocJ ... lighting candles, not cursing darknesses ... !
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mruppert
Posted 7/26/2008 1:55 AM (#7729 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Hi all:
     Maybe it is best to try to consider it in perspective...so I offer you one of my perspectives on it.....I was a student at Catholic U during the late '60's. CUA is in Washington, DC, our nations capital, and the city had gone through some of the worst rioting that could ever be imagined....it made the Motor City Burning look like a July 4th sparkler. There was great racial tension, as Washington is NOT what you believe it to be, it IS a predominately black city, nothing new to me or my sisters, as we grew up in Brooklyn, New York.
      During these tense times, I and my sister (the other one came later) walked about wherever we wanted quite freely. The kids from other places hid in their dorms, and phoned their parents hourly, to let them know that they hadn't yet been savaged and raped.
       I was going up to see some friends who lived in an apartment over Hefley's Stationary Store on 12th St, NE.
WARNING....THE NEXT PART HAS GRAPHIC LANGUAGE (THOUGH HIDDEN) AND IF YOU MIGHT BE OFFENDED CLICK TO ANOTHER FORUM.........if you believe in guardians than you must read further....and suck the graphic language up as part of the experience!

Okay, I had walked up Otis St to 12th and was heading towards Perry St, which is where my friends lived, across the street, on 12th. Four black dudes accosted me. I told them that I ain't givin them my money. One of the dudes responded that they didn't want no money , that they just wanted to kill some white m$#e#sF&c%e%r.  A gun came out, and I remember staring at that barrel, thinking that I could jump aside the second the bullet left the barrel. I really thought, now I am truly f^c$ed! But then, they started to pummel me, and I went down fairly quick, as they were far more in numbers and much bigger than I. I "covered up" to avoid blows that could be fatal........and all of a sudden there was this unearthly scream!!!!
     Now, I know you all may not want to believe this, but I will tell you exactly what happened...and perhaps cause even one of you to rethink when I say that miracles and angels exist, because they do.......
      Whenever there is a blood curdling scream, it is human nature to turn your head and look in the direction it came from. As I did, so did my assailents. What we saw was a dude fly off the balcony of the very place I was going, and sail effortless across a city street and land at my feet!!!!!
     Needless to say, my attackers  took off tout-sweet! They beat their feet. Feet dont fail me now!!!!!! Gone!
      And a guy named Tom Dundin, standing over me asking me if I was all right, did I need help?
      He 'flew" off a balcony and across a street, to save my a@@. Five people saw it!
       I have believed in miracles ever since. 
So, from one of my tastes of death,
Peace and Love,
Marty and KittyKats, Lucky, Poppy and Sissy
P.S. My little Inky was alive then, and she would have been an orphan if I never came home!
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Rose
Posted 7/26/2008 3:42 AM (#7733 - in reply to #7688)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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One thing I notice from taking the courses is how much more empowered I feel. My inner strength is growing and glowing.

On Death...after my Mother's death I could still hear her voice just as clearly as if she were alive. I felt a big warm hug from her the night she passed. I was crying and was so deeply upset that I didn't think I could bear all the pain, but then out of no where this big warm hug and just like that all the pain subsided and it felt as though I hadn't been crying. I've never felt anything like that, ever before.

This is a wonderful thread...

Much Love and Peace to all of you.....
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/26/2008 8:03 AM (#7739 - in reply to #7729)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Marty - resonate right on with miracles and, Rose, miraculous living ... i am sure I posted on this before, Heaven on the Underground or some such but cannot find it ... will recount those miraculous happenings in my recent life if anyone is interested, without wishing to be repetitive ... but certainly my feel is that the more we open ourselves to live intuitively, the universe responds and sends us miracles, of all kinds xx
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sunflower
Posted 7/26/2008 8:15 AM (#7740 - in reply to #7671)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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oh tracey,what a lovely thing to say,thankyou,what i love about you is your kind,genuine,words,straight from the heart.I read your post,on death,and the lesson,and i can connect with some,but not understanding all,only because i have not reached your level of understanding,which i dearly hope to do.You know,when you talked about being with your brother,when he was dying,it brought tears to my eyes,but also an understanding.I have a long way to go,but i take gentle steps.One thing i must say is,to me there is a difference between death,and dying.I say this,because the actual word death itself,brings fear,but i have experienced the final moments,from my daughters last moments,before she went home.The mc millan nurses had a word with her,and asked if she knew what was happening,she said i know i am dying,but i am not afraid,i worry about what will become of my mum,and my brothers.So,as i had travelled this journey with her,there were lots of different moments.I remeber her being upset,and saying to me,i thinkthis will be my ast christmas,then birthday,she was afraid,but i reassured her,that it was not so.Its along story,so i won,t go on,but weeks before the end,it was obvious she had a foothold in the next world,and one on this earthpane,she had seen home,but was attached to earth,family,etc.but,and this is my point,what she had seen of home.was so beautiful,so loving,its where her spirit belonged,hence the words,i am not afraid of dying,passing,going home.Am i making sense between the known,and the unknown,it is human to fear,but once at the gateway,the brigde,fear is not a spirit experience.Okay,love and light,all things good,love and hugs irisxxx
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/26/2008 8:52 AM (#7744 - in reply to #7740)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Perfect sense, Sunflower. Blessings x
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Kiddo Green
Posted 7/27/2008 1:33 AM (#7826 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


Hello-
I am new to the forum and I am a new student. I just found this line of discussion cogent to my personal experience and interesting. I am in both a 'grieving process" and a living-with-dying situation right now. I lost a dear friend and confidente this last year to suicide (not my first, but I hope my last), and my mother has leukemia and breast cancer. I also have a 22 month old son.

While I myself am welland I am not dying myself, my mother's impending demise as well as the recent death of my friend has forced me to take a closer look at death, the grieving process and life/living. It has literally shaken my existential foundation. (let me just say that I have worked in the field of pyschology for years. I have been counseling for some time. I find that no matter how much wisdom I spew out day after day, the words and insights somehow seem trivial and meaningless when I am faced with crises myself. I can say that I am gaining a deeper wisdom through this process. I am sure to come out stronger...if it doesn't kill me! (hahaha!)

Anyway, the subject is so much on my mind, I wonder how much of the grieving is my own and how much of it is someone else's, i.e. my dear departed friend's wandering soul or even some of my mother's misdirected and projected grief. I am just mired in it. So much so, that sometimes it feels like "I" am suicidal. I just feel nutty. When I sit back and center myself, i realize that it is merely my desire to kill the feelings inside. My unconscious is crying out, "kill the pain, end this now!" It is so simple it is ridiculous. Albeit, painful!

So, the process is unfolding as it should. I agree with an earlier post that we fear the process. I also believe that we fear the loss. And, if it someone very dear to us and we do not know how to commune with them in the beyond, we fear the Silence and the Void. We might fear that the memories will fade or that a piece of us is dying with the departed.

I am going to give my OPINION here: I believe the subject of death and dying to be a complex one, principally because it is such an emotionally charged topic. As humans, we just can't help it. Many are confused and frightened by death, while others are not. Of course, there are some that do not fear death in and of itself. (It is not so scary when you really look at it. And, why fear what you don't know, right?) But, I think if we look at death and dying only from this one perspective, then we would be overlooking our human experience as first sentient beings and secondly as social beings. These two inherent qualities make the human experience of death and dying confusing, painful and frightening. The topic is so much more complex than just one's own death. When faced with the inevitable, we become aware of own mortality, our own purpose/meaning, and, as such, own our decline and loss of value/worth. Likewise, we might fear losing loved ones, we might wonder if their memories will fade and what does that mean: do we love them any less? And, what will happen when we go? Will others remember me? Do others love me? Am I loved? These are just SOME things that people ponder and have shared with me through my counsleing practice and I myself have uncovered through my own personal experience.

For my own experience with the process, I personally dread my own mother's passing and I fear any 'mother issues' still yet unresolved. I find myself in a hurry to resolve them as quickly as possible. It makes it vey difficult to be present in the moment for myself, my mother, and my family. Yes, I am aware of what is happening, but some some reason, I am simply compelled to press on with my campaign to 'make it all better'. I know that the solution is within myself. And, perhaps, I am getting closer to that point.

Another way to look at it is that death represents the ultimate change in the human life cycle. Even the most fluid, flexible and faithful individual will at some point be faced with this inevitable change. How the person perceives and copes with the finality is really what is in question here. And, I bleive truly believe that even the faithful has doubts when it comes to death. And, again it may not be the kind of doubts/fears that one normally expects.

I share my personal experience/reflections of pain and fear not for sympathy, but to support the position that death and dying is a painful and sometimes indeed a frightening prospect.

Anyway, I am babbling. I didn't realize I had so much to say. I certainly hope I didn't offend anyone.

Take care and have a good evening.

With fae'th,
Cara



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Kiddo Green
Posted 7/27/2008 1:33 AM (#7827 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


Hello-
I am new to the forum and I am a new student. I just found this line of discussion cogent to my personal experience and interesting. I am in both a 'grieving process" and a living-with-dying situation right now. I lost a dear friend and confidente this last year to suicide (not my first, but I hope my last), and my mother has leukemia and breast cancer. I also have a 22 month old son.

While I myself am welland I am not dying myself, my mother's impending demise as well as the recent death of my friend has forced me to take a closer look at death, the grieving process and life/living. It has literally shaken my existential foundation. (let me just say that I have worked in the field of pyschology for years. I have been counseling for some time. I find that no matter how much wisdom I spew out day after day, the words and insights somehow seem trivial and meaningless when I am faced with crises myself. I can say that I am gaining a deeper wisdom through this process. I am sure to come out stronger...if it doesn't kill me! (hahaha!)

Anyway, the subject is so much on my mind, I wonder how much of the grieving is my own and how much of it is someone else's, i.e. my dear departed friend's wandering soul or even some of my mother's misdirected and projected grief. I am just mired in it. So much so, that sometimes it feels like "I" am suicidal. I just feel nutty. When I sit back and center myself, i realize that it is merely my desire to kill the feelings inside. My unconscious is crying out, "kill the pain, end this now!" It is so simple it is ridiculous. Albeit, painful!

So, the process is unfolding as it should. I agree with an earlier post that we fear the process. I also believe that we fear the loss. And, if it someone very dear to us and we do not know how to commune with them in the beyond, we fear the Silence and the Void. We might fear that the memories will fade or that a piece of us is dying with the departed.

I am going to give my OPINION here: I believe the subject of death and dying to be a complex one, principally because it is such an emotionally charged topic. As humans, we just can't help it. Many are confused and frightened by death, while others are not. Of course, there are some that do not fear death in and of itself. (It is not so scary when you really look at it. And, why fear what you don't know, right?) But, I think if we look at death and dying only from this one perspective, then we would be overlooking our human experience as first sentient beings and secondly as social beings. These two inherent qualities make the human experience of death and dying confusing, painful and frightening. The topic is so much more complex than just one's own death. When faced with the inevitable, we become aware of own mortality, our own purpose/meaning, and, as such, own our decline and loss of value/worth. Likewise, we might fear losing loved ones, we might wonder if their memories will fade and what does that mean: do we love them any less? And, what will happen when we go? Will others remember me? Do others love me? Am I loved? These are just SOME things that people ponder and have shared with me through my counsleing practice and I myself have uncovered through my own personal experience.

For my own experience with the process, I personally dread my own mother's passing and I fear any 'mother issues' still yet unresolved. I find myself in a hurry to resolve them as quickly as possible. It makes it vey difficult to be present in the moment for myself, my mother, and my family. Yes, I am aware of what is happening, but some some reason, I am simply compelled to press on with my campaign to 'make it all better'. I know that the solution is within myself. And, perhaps, I am getting closer to that point.

Another way to look at it is that death represents the ultimate change in the human life cycle. Even the most fluid, flexible and faithful individual will at some point be faced with this inevitable change. How the person perceives and copes with the finality is really what is in question here. And, I bleive truly believe that even the faithful has doubts when it comes to death. And, again it may not be the kind of doubts/fears that one normally expects.

I share my personal experience/reflections of pain and fear not for sympathy, but to support the position that death and dying is a painful and sometimes indeed a frightening prospect.

Anyway, I am babbling. I didn't realize I had so much to say. I certainly hope I didn't offend anyone.

Take care and have a good evening.

With fae'th,
Cara



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Kiddo Green
Posted 7/27/2008 1:39 AM (#7828 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


sorry for the multi post. My connection went haywire when i hit the submit button.

c
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/27/2008 3:58 AM (#7829 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Good to hear from you dear Cara; welcome to the Board; but I am so sorry to hear of your situation and value your sharing it. My father died in 2005 and such passings, anticipatory and afterwards, are always with us and remind us - me, anyway - of the fragility of our time here.

Blessings

Paul
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sunflower
Posted 7/27/2008 7:31 AM (#7839 - in reply to #7827)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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dearest cara,you have in no way offended anyone,i deeply sympathise with your current situation.You seem to be very much in tune with your inner self,and my thoughts and love are with you throughout.You are right in saying the subject to be comlex,as so many differnt situations,call for different reactions,emotions,i admire your strengh,and courage,and do beleive that it is not death or dying that is fearful as such,but the process.Someone once said,of another,who was giving advice,to truly understand,walk a mile in my shoes,very true.I will not go on,as i usualy do,but had to say,there is so much differences for people,in the same situation,that they may all be on the same path,but for each the experience,and outcome ,will inevitably be different.love and peace to you my friend,irisx
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instinctual
Posted 7/27/2008 5:54 PM (#7847 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Hi Cara..welcome and I wish you much happiness, joy and peace on your path.

Lori
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mruppert
Posted 7/27/2008 11:30 PM (#7860 - in reply to #7827)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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And, I bleive truly believe that even the faithful has doubts when itcomes to death. And, again it may not be the kind of doubts/fears thatone normally expects.

Hello CaraKiddo,
     Just as you believe, so do I....but, I believe with the essence of my being, that "we" move, by convention, from one state of being to another. I am convinced that we also can move freely between several states of being!
     We had to give a name to the state of being after our corporeal body ceases to function in relation to those around us. We made up a word "death" and it takes on a ominous meaning. The word is different for others, muerte, omerte, thanos..blah blah blah. It is just a word! It bears little relation as to what actually occurs.
     It is like the word "ghost"...you say the word "ghost" and it is a conditioned reaction to think that the presence is somehow misguided, malevolent or downright evil. And, we treat it as such. BUT, we don't know that to be true! However, the word ghost instills automatic fear in us, much the same response as Pavlov's dogs to a ringing bell. In other words, conditioned and responsive to the terms of the conditioning.
      Let me try another way of putting this....you see an ant crawling along a sidewalk, and you step on that ant. Did the ant suffer any anxiety over the foot that was about to step on it? The ant had no fear, just purpose!
      Now, you will say that the ant in my example does not think. You are basically correct. But, we DO think, and that is why it seems to me so completely irrational to fear something that we know will inevitably happen. We would like it to be more pleasant than a foot smashing us, but sometimes it is not. Yet, if you are spiritually guided, it is not a cause for torment, but a door to another place, maybe more joyous than one can imagine.
If you wish, go to My Chymical Wedding, and read more about this subject.

Peace and Love,
Marty and CittyCats, Lucky, Poppy and Sisssssyyyyyy
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/28/2008 12:56 AM (#7867 - in reply to #7860)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Perhaps many people do fear death (the unknown to some), and I couldn't agree more, but I have ZERO fear of death, it's not unknown to me, it's a known. I don't know why to be honest, I think I feel it's a reward. But I have always been backwards on just about everything.

   I also agree very much about the word DEATH, sounding so scary. But all things that are born, must die, and all things that die, will be re-born. I give tarot readings, and when the death card comes out, people tend to have a panic look on their face. I say "no need to fear, the death card means new beginnings". I tell them it also means the end of what it's next to. In my last case, the death card was next to an aggressive card, so I told the client that their father was going to stop being forceful, less aggressive and more passive.  She explained that he already has become less aggressive. I confirmed what she already knew.

     Marty states "It is like the word "ghost"...you say the word "ghost" and it is a conditioned reaction to think that the presence is somehow misguided, malevolent or downright evil". You got that right.... unless your a ghost hunter, even talking about ghosts just freaks people out. I cannot stand it when other ghost hunting teams jump to conclusions about ghosts being evil. Chances are slim to none that a ghost is really evil..... maybe holding on to it's shadow side, confused, lost, but 99% of it being EVIL. 

Another thing I feel Marty is right about: Conditioning. We are all programmed from the time we are born, till the day we die. Because our brains learn on a constant level. We are always watching, observing, taking in and filing such data. If we were raised certain ways, while that instilled morals, much of it is overkill and control. I spend many days re-programming people out of depression.... in exchange for heightened self esteem. I have watched people transform, in a matter of two hours of self acceptance through hypnosis. But.... we are more than our brains... we are eternal energy and intelligence. So, if we go deep, we can dig for cell memory. Past life regressions are fantastic for reaching cell memory..... Eternal intelligence.

Death..... is none. just change.... It is those left behind that suffer. A temporary condition.  

I did not mean to ramble.... it's late and i have been missing my time in here.
Blessings~

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mruppert
Posted 7/28/2008 4:20 AM (#7874 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Yes, indeed, that famous card in the tarot, the thirtenth of the major arcana.....the bridge card between the tenth (Fortune) and the sixtenth (Destruction), 26 divided by 2=13. Complementary to the eightenth card (Moon).
Jillster is one of the few people who undertstand this stuff, and that is why I love her.

Peace Out....
Marty and Cartographic Cats, Luck, Popp and Siss 
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/28/2008 7:21 PM (#7902 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Welp, on my way back to hospital, I guess we are pulling the tubes out tonight. He is not improving and it's clearly written in his will that he did NOT want life support. We are sticking to his wishes, looks like today is the day. Will be back later...
HUGS
Jill
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instinctual
Posted 7/28/2008 7:35 PM (#7905 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Jilly-Sending you and your father and all souls involved blessings and surrounding you all with white light..

Lots of Love
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mruppert
Posted 7/28/2008 8:05 PM (#7909 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Ohhhhhhhh Jill, walk with god, and know that, if it were me, I would want someone with enough guts to yank the plug. There is more to life, than we will ever ever know...a neverending story!

Bitter and Sweet tears,
Marty and sadcats, Luck, Popp and Siss 
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Kiddo Green
Posted 7/29/2008 1:31 AM (#7913 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


I know you don't know me, Jill. Just know that I am thinking of you and praying for you.

Much love,
Cara
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/29/2008 11:41 AM (#7931 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Hey Cara, Welcome! Good to see you here. Thank you for your prayers.
Also, Thank you Marty and Lori....and everyone else who has sent their healing energy. It's working. 

Can you all believe that he is breathing on his own? His blood pressure even went down a little bit. They were amazed at how well he is doing. So we have to debate whether or not we place him back on anti-biotics. Since that isn't life support, we will say yes.

While I am afraid to get my hopes up, we cannot believe he is actually improving with out being forced to breathe. This may be temporary, but I hope not.

Thank you again~



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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/29/2008 12:19 PM (#7933 - in reply to #7931)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Blessings & continuing healing to you and yours then Jill ... as in my bee story of Sunday (from the sublime to the ridiculous, possibly ...) .... 'never say die' !
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/29/2008 4:59 PM (#7958 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Well, I guess we have to let go..... He is not conscious. Still breathing on his own, his breathing has gotten shallower. We are placing him in a hospice center. It may be a couple days, or another month, but he won't make it through in this body. He has not regained consciousness....

So, basically we have to prepare for his death. Our family is trying to decide whether to creamate or burry. Both his parents were creamated, so I am pretty sure that is the rout we will go.

I personally plan on creamation. I just cannot see taking up unneeded space, while turning earth into one huge coffin death star. If we keep burring all our dead in non-biodegradable metal coffins, we will ultimately create one huge metal star, maybe a super large satelite. LOL I dunno, i think of Star Wars and the planet made of metal..... Death Star.... You know the one.

I personally do not want to be burried at all. If my husband needs that, he may do it, but NO COFFIN, unless it's bio-degradable.... like my body. My schmo dawg was barried in a cardboard box and I feel that is good enough for me too. But, would rather be creamated and placed in a jar, with a happy face on it. Specifically placed on my hubby's night stand. If he dates again, his new girl will say..... oh, that is a beautiful vase, what is that? He will say.... My Wife, and she is still here with us. HA HA HA HA The look will be priceless.....

I know, I already know that is how I would want it, IF I go first. If I don't.... I know this is sick, but I want to keep my hubby's skull. Wonder if they will let me? He knows it and said, heck, he won't be needing it, so why not. He is placing that in his will.  LOLOL  I have always wanted a human skull for deco. I am a halloween freak. It could be halloween all year round, still my favorate. I told him I was going to place some bling on his tooth.... then said, NAW.... j/k

We both tease the crap out of each other on a daily basis, but we are so close, it's like our minds are connected, our souls are one. He knows it when I am not feeling good, before I tell him. I know his thoughts too.... it's so freaky to be so twin like.

I still have no fear of death. I do fear my kids not having me though.... i fear their loneliness. I fear them needing their momma, and their momma not being there for them. That is what I fear. If I lost one of them, honestly, I would want to join them as soon as I could. Yet I would know that the others still need me. So I guess I let fate run it's course and don't worry about it much, knowing that when it's my time, it's my time. What is..... is.  It's all good.

Off to say good bye to dad. I am taking my mom with me. They have been divorced for over 35 years, but she still loves him deep down. She feels guilty now for leaving him. I have held onto a lot of resentment towards my father. Time to let it go..... Time to love him, unconditionally, so he can take that with him.

I finally started to cry.... I feel so awkward, yet sad. I live a very spoiled life, filled with friends, love, a whole different family and everything I need. I didn't have my dad growing up, but got over that. Now there is no chance to ever rekindle a closeness. My sister and I enherit everything, his partner just died too, it's weird. Not sure how to handle that either. I feel guilty, because I know this will help my own family get out of debt. But I didn't want it this way....i would have rather stuggled, and had my dad live longer, happier.

Ohhh what a strange feeling. Somewhat lost.... will lay back and just let it flow.

The conjure one song i put in the song section is my life. to a T.

HUGS and blessings to all....






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Kiddo Green
Posted 7/29/2008 5:19 PM (#7959 - in reply to #7958)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


WOW! So much going on. As you write, I reflect on my own cricumstance...not in a selfish way, but in a contemplative way. That's how it should be, and I am glad you are participating in this forum. It reminds me that I am right where I am supposed to be, doing exactly what I am supposed to be doing, CONSCIOUSLY...though not perfectly.

I just can't imagine...and I try not to imagine what it will be like...because I just won't know until it actually happens.

Again, love, strength, and peace,
Cara
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/29/2008 5:31 PM (#7960 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Thank you Cara,
I do so much beleive in fate and that we are exactly where we are supposed to be at all times.
Even if we do not like it, it's our choice to change it, but then again, known change anyway.

I just don't know what to expect, or how long things will keep going for him. Certainly not too long. At least perhaps we can take the IV out. He was a pin cushion for the last 60 days.

Comfort is all we want now. Or a tempropedic pillow. (anyone watch weeds?) lol.

Thanks so much for being here with me. I finally was able to dedicate some time to my favorate forum and friends.

Blessings~



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Kiddo Green
Posted 7/30/2008 3:30 AM (#7975 - in reply to #7960)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


LOL! yes, I love the show Weeds. And, I love my tempurpedic and its pillows. Got to love it.

WEll, I am glad you can laugh through this. IT soothes the soul.

Much love, Cara
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/30/2008 3:59 AM (#7977 - in reply to #7975)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Location: United Kingdom
My mother still has around her flat, the ashes of various pets they have had over the years, now added to with the ashes of my father; I have given up trying to persuade me to scater them in the sea, as he would have wished, I think, as clearly she is not ready for that ... it is very very hard to know what is for the best ...

.... to save funeral fees, and to make useful use of my body, i have signed it over en bloc to medical science - though they only seem to want you if you died 'in good health' !!?? maybe they don;t you if you are mashed up in road kill (sorry, getting macabre now) ... but my family are unhappy with this becuase they will have no grave to visit ... there is a once a year serice for all who have gone in this way, but my wife feels it not fair on the children ...( I cannot be buried with them because I am not Jewish ! Ha ha - the Rabbi asked if I would be willing to convert, i said, from what to what ... (since all religions are a unity for me) ...

.... even in death there is much room for confusion and misunderstanding

Hope it goes well, in any event Jill, as well as it can x

Blessings
Paul

Edited by Paul Joseph 7/30/2008 4:00 AM
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sunflower
Posted 7/30/2008 4:48 AM (#7987 - in reply to #7958)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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each to his own,and i greatly sympathise with your situation,you have been very graphic,and indeed must be under a lot of stress.Whilst it may be true that burying a loved one in the ground,may seem a waste of earth,space,i feel,it is much more innocuous,to be using natures bounty for the greed of man,such as cutting down trees,desroying beautiful pastures green,or any space deemed vacant,to build highways,unsightly buildings,etc,so man can travel from a to b faster,or build numerous flats,offices,much of which are not needed,or indeed used,especialy for the poor people who really need them,but are not consisdered,because of the pricing etc.I personaly,would rather be sitting in the peace and stillness of a cemetry,where i find a lot of spiritual comfort,and feel surrounded by divine love.I feel,that as my daughter was,and still is a very kind,loving spiritual person,she would have wanted the burial i gave her,for our last goodbye,earth to earth,for i feel that burning,cremation,is a sort of pick and mix,i.e.not as much care and thought is put into it,and the ashes burned and retrieved,scooped into an urn,are,by knowing a cremation attendent,not those entirely of a loved one exclusively,therefore if you were god forbid to cremate your beloved husband,and keep him by your bedside,he may indeed be in there with mabel,or
alice.This of course is an opinion,at the end of the day,the body is just a shell,and the spirit has aready departed,long before the ceremony,and gone home.I did feel that your words touched a nerve,but i know.with love,was not intended,but has now made me ponder on what i did for my daughter, she herself was unable to make the choice,was what she would have wanted,in conclusion,and by an instant thought,the answer is yes.Therefore,i will leave you with my sincere loving thoughts,and reflect what was discussed.
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Chotuni
Posted 7/30/2008 7:56 AM (#7999 - in reply to #7977)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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Hi all, Many years ago my Father was a fireman and my Mother saw a friend who she han't seen for a long time and the friend asked about my Dad. My Mom replied he had been burnt and her friend, knowing his job, said she hoped it hadn't been bad, to which my Mom replied "Well they don't mess about in these crematoriums". Anyway getting back to the point my brother recently died in Italy and being a Catholic country there were problems with cremation and eventually permission was given but to cut a long story short he was cremated at a municipal site and the urn his wife was given contained all sorts.Sorry to digress again but my Mom had my Dad's urn on the mantlepiece and an old Uncle used to visit and would flick the ash off his cigar into the urn. My Grandma, who came by only rarely, once visited and was looking at his ashes and said,"Do you know I think Arthur is putting on weight" Well she was a little"eccentric". Getting back to the point personally I wish to be buried in  biodegradable wicker basket with a tree planted on top of me. I know exactly where I want it to be but it is on land owned by a University and I don't know if they would allow it.I am not asking yet as hopefully it won't be for a while.  
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sunflower
Posted 7/30/2008 8:37 AM (#8002 - in reply to #7977)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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ohh paulo,to turn your body over to medical science,you get paid a large fee in advance,i.e. before you are dead,me thinks this is the reason,but you were rejected,as there was nothing of your person worth using,hahah!By the way,how come the posts are moved from their original standing,at someones will,to make it look completely different in context,to the true meaning,of what the post was referrring to.Is this an act of god,or someone trying to play god,with others sensitive issues,there is an awful lot ofshall we saykissing the bottom,and some made out to to be revered,almost on a pedestal,when in fact,if lookd at in true reality,a peice of paper,is just that,a piece of paper,some with meaningless typed words on,which in fact mean,nothing,nul and void.Oh my,never mind the ramlings of a young woman,who truly beleives,with mind,body,spirit soul,that the deciding factor,the truth,in all its glory,lies in the hands of the divine.I strongly beleive in karma,forever i will defend the TRUE spirit,until i go to my true home,there at least,i will see the whole picture,and the real truth,on this earthplane,we are easily clouded,and deceived,see you at the gate!!! Still think someone is deliberately messing with my computer,my doctor has not certified me neurotic,mentaly ill,so on,and the house is still active with light and dark.Fairwell,my fairweathered friend.
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/30/2008 8:49 AM (#8005 - in reply to #8002)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Chothuni - I am sorry for your loss; please accept my condolences.

Sunflower - sorry but I am not sure again, what you are saying here : I have not been paid to donate my body; it just seemed a sensible thing to do, but I wa also poitning out the emotions involved that might make me change my mind ... I too think the idea of natural burials is beter for the longer term of the planet, but they require more planning that i feel able to give to it ...

./.. not sure what you mean about posts being moved from their original standing ... or the next part of what you say ... I thought everyone was seeking to show respect for everyone else here; if you feel I have been disrespectful in any way, please let me know ...

... and as for fairweathered friend, again, I am non-plussed, a little hurt, if I am honest, but there we go.

I may just have the wrong end of the stick. Best to you, as ever
Paul
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sunflower
Posted 7/30/2008 8:57 AM (#8008 - in reply to #8005)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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no,no,no,i am so sorry,i didn,t mean to hurt you in any way,i sicerely apologise if that is the case,you amongst others ,i would never,ever deilberately hurt,if you hurt,i hurt,if you cry,icry,if you laugh,i laugh.luv and hugs irisxxx
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/30/2008 9:00 AM (#8009 - in reply to #8008)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Oh then that's a relief; phew;

Relieved of Mafeking x
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/30/2008 10:38 AM (#8015 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Sorry to hear of such trauma Chotuni, Love and hugs to you. Sunflower, I can certainly understand why some would burry, as I do not think it's wrong, I just see it as something I do not want personally. Not at any time would I feel that those who want that, should not be able to do that. I too, love sitting in a grave yard, but soon our world will be nothing but grave yards. I also have plenty of loved ones in those grave yards, and well.... we always grant the wishes of our loved ones.

As far as creamation, I know it's possible to have a little mix of left overs from others into the urn too. But primarily, it would be mostly them. It's only the thought of them, aftarwards, that keeps the love going. I carried my mother-in-law home on my lap, after her funural and I thought that was a unique experience. The urn was heavier than I ever imagined and it's sealed. Nobody would be flicking their ashes into it. I do find that disprespectful, but I am sure it was an innocent mistake. People sometimes do not pay attention to small details. Once I found a beautiful vase inside of a second hand store, and when i picked it up to get a closer look, it was an urn. Filled..... Oh my. I took it to the store manager and explained that they were selling someones remains. Did they know that? They were shocked.... So those urns do not always look like urns.

It is my own personal desire to be creamated over being buried, but by no means should someone feel they should do as I think..... I feel everyone should do as THEY feel.... Many see things differently and that is what makes us all wonderful.

My dad is now in hospice. I am about to leave and go spend time with him. He doesn't have long.

Hugs and LOVE, and so sorry I accidently offended someone elses belief system. Not my intention at all. To each their own.... with love.
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instinctual
Posted 7/30/2008 11:10 AM (#8017 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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Jilly-

Dad is where he needs to be, as you say, and this is true. Hospice is wonderful because they focus purely on palliative care and comfort. They are angels there. Lots of wonderful drugs that can just help him with pain ( not necessarily OUCH-my toe hurts pain ) but outward signs of pain, especially for someone unable to speak...ie increased respirations and increased blood pressure, facial grimacing, agitation, etc ). Hang touch, keeping crying, girl...such power in those tears.

Love and Light sweet friend~
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Rose
Posted 7/30/2008 11:19 AM (#8018 - in reply to #8017)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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This is so true instinctual. My Father is doing much better under care. At least he's happy and healthy. And he's gotten used to his roommate. So he makes lots of friends.

Love and Peace to you and keeping Doc, Instinctual and all in my Prayers...
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/30/2008 12:28 PM (#8027 - in reply to #8018)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



PhD Alumni

200020001002525
Location: United Kingdom
Blessings and health to your father then also, dear Rose x
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Paul Joseph
Posted 7/31/2008 4:45 AM (#8073 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



PhD Alumni

200020001002525
Location: United Kingdom
Derr. sorry Cara, i didn;t understand your last but one paragraph ... who is scraping what barrel and who or what is convo ?
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sunflower
Posted 7/31/2008 5:17 AM (#8081 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


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Posts: 750
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yes ,kiddo sir,i agree,i was maybe caught at a sensitive time,and it brought back painful memories,which made me question,what i did,was it right,etc,as i do agree,that undertakers,make far too much money,out of peoples grief,when a time they are vulnerable,and not in their right mind,to make choices,but go with the flow,as the last thing on a grieving persons mind is,"what sort of wood would you like,what do you want on the inscription",what handles,etc etc etc,when your child is being taken away,in front of your eyes,in a body bag,not meaning to sound macabre,but such s true life.Now time has passed,and i am at peace with my daughters memories,the fun,the laughter,the caring and sharing,and as i also have a great faith in the afterlife,a knowing,and proof she is still around,i am at peace,but as one knows,in grief,even after many years,a song,a smell,a word,can cause all to come tumbling back,and whilst in that moment moment of time,the pain makes us srtrike out in different ways.Okay,a deep breath has been taken,and i thankyou for that,but it was never my intention to hurt gill,or anyone,in their hour of need,having travelled that road,i would be the last person to add hurt or pain,to an already hurting spirit. To,now leave that were it shoud be,in past,i now address gill,in her hour of need and pain,and say,most sincerely,gill,my heart and love walk with your every step,and having experienced the workings of the hospices,and their special staff,if i were not have been allowed to bring my daughter home,i would have taken her to my nearest hospice,Ty Gobaith,as i support them greatly,and admire the works they do,my disgust is the government do not fund them,they have to rely on donations,etc..Okay,enough said,i hope all is understood,even though i go round about it in the wrong way,my heart spirit speaks,but the written word does not express the totality,and true meaning.love and peace,irisx
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Supernatural3
Posted 7/31/2008 1:21 PM (#8113 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



PhD Alumni

Posts: 1673
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Location: NE Ohio
Hello all,

Thank you so much for all your support, it was felt deeply.

My dad passed away last night at 6:10pm. He heard his last breath.... but it was the whiteness in his face that took place at that moment. We saw the blood leave his cheeks, and spread out. We all gathered closer, just to have his body, PUSH all the air out... we all jumped back. Holy Bajeeba's..... then his face turned even whiter. He was gone.

Family was all there when it happened, and for some reason, I think he was waiting for my mother to get there to let go. It wasn't long after she got there, that he let go. We all hugged and cried for both is relief, and his being gone.

I then couldn't sleep last night.... I just wanted to see him in my home. I wanted to look for his spirit. As I have seen my grandfathers spirit, I somehow expect the same. I need this....

We are having him creamated, as per his own wishes. I will be keeping his urn in my home.

Anyway, this nightmare is over. He is at peace....In a much better place and we all know it.

Now the nightmare of all his stuff..... ACK, so much to do.

Blessings and Thanks again for all your support.
Jill
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Tracy Martin
Posted 7/31/2008 4:48 PM (#8120 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



Alumni

Posts: 486
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Location: California
I hear you missing his presence Jill. Love you! 
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sunflower
Posted 7/31/2008 5:51 PM (#8121 - in reply to #8113)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?


Elite Veteran

Posts: 750
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gill,i am so sorry,i am actualy crying,my deepest love and healing please be with you,i send a pink rose,one a petal on your pillow,to smell the sweetness when you awake,and one for your heart,that the loving assists in the healing.Sorry,i can,t say anymore,except the most important thing,I LOVE YOU,with the greatest of sincerity,love and hugs to you,now and aways,irisxxx
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Paul Joseph
Posted 8/1/2008 4:33 AM (#8151 - in reply to #8113)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



PhD Alumni

200020001002525
Location: United Kingdom
Deepest condolences, empathies and symapthies DocJ

.... can I say perhaps,

......... the Passage into the Light continues ....
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Supernatural3
Posted 8/1/2008 11:30 PM (#8236 - in reply to #7640)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



PhD Alumni

Posts: 1673
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Location: NE Ohio
Hey everyone,
Thank you so much for all the support. I really need it, personally.
Seems to be ok, then of course, my sister is causing all kinds of BS. Blaming me for crap and well, I am a mess. While we know I didn't cause the illness, I am being blamed for wanting part of his ashes. Geesh, I don't know why anyone would have a problem with that. Fights are breaking out left and right, and I have just stepped back and said... Screw it. I am out of it all. I never did get a long with my sister, and there is a classic reason, at which was proved once again. As spiritual as I am, I cannot force another to be..... so to each their own. They will deal with their greif in other ways.
I sit and focus on other things.
Blessings~




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mruppert
Posted 8/2/2008 1:14 AM (#8243 - in reply to #8236)
Subject: RE: DEATH ANYONE?



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And, as I told you Jilly, you always have my support!
But, as I also told you, I see you in quite a different way than others do.
Daddy wants you to make peace among all the warring factions.
Daddy wants you to be in the thick of things, and deal with sisters of opposite minds.

Jill, do what you do best! You are a natural healer!

P&L
Marty and Sillycats Luckvah, Poppelstein, and Sissvah
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